Will and Dis-Grace.
Jan. 31st, 2003 11:54 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
eggwardsI’m upset at the show “Will & Grace” today. Last night’s episode was terrible. The show has gone so far off it’s original promise, in my mind, and is now just trying to see what they can get away with, and how much gay stereotyping that they can do.
It was one thing when there was “Just Jack”. Jack and Karen were the comic relief. Then they took over the show. Their characters were funnier, though not more interesting, than Will and Grace. Will and grace had a friendship, and that was boring, apparently. So they let Grace date and get married. Good for the character, bad for the show’s premise since she’s moved out. Will, though hadn’t progressed much because they hardly let him date. He meets up with a guy occasionally, but more often than not, he ends up being the foil for Jack who’s out doing something stupid. Oh how fun.
Now Will, having a real, caring relationship with a guy would be a step in the right direction. Then He and Grace could deal with their husbands, etc. But no. Here’s the synopsis of last night’s show.
"Fagmalion Part Two: Attack of the Clones"
Will and Jack coach Karen's cousin (Dan Futterman) on his new gay lifestyle.
What fun. They teach the new guy, who's recently left his wife and decided to come out, how to be gay. How do they do it? Tell him he’s got to have great abs, lose the beard, learn to dance, not like or understand sports, and wear expensive Gucci shoes. And Will and Jack are doing it to Help Karen get revenge on her Fundamentalist Aunt and Uncle, and because Karen offered to pay them to do it.
I know this isn’t real life, but there’s a few of really bad messages here. 1. Will and Jack don’t care about anyone but themselves. 2. There are no good mentors for those who are coming out. 3. Gays are all vapid little tramps. 4. There’s no room for diversity in the gay community.
We all know that the last one isn’t true, but your average viewer of the show doesn’t know that. Nowhere in the show was there talk of bears, chubs, minorities, etc. He was never told that there are other ways to be gay. That not all gay men are like that, and there is more than just looks. This is from the show that couldn't have a gay relationship last more than 2 episodes, of course.
Naturally, by the end of the show, like Pygmalion (or My Fair Lady, if you’re more familiar) the guy starts wearing the Gucci shoes and espousing “fabulous” and his mentors are thrilled that he’s finally got it. This is funny?
What a terrible message from a show that consistently wins awards from glaad.
This is especially discouraging to me. Since I still feel that I’m in the process of coming out to the community, and learning what’s out there, this show makes me feel terrible. If I hadn’t learned about bears, and other groups, how would I feel about myself trying to enter Will and Jack’s world? I’m sure there’s plenty of others in the closet now who watched last night's show. How must they be feeling?
Why do the writers and producers feel they must change the cousin to make him fit in with this one part of gay life? Do they think that this is really skewering the stereotypes? Not if you thought Will was a few steps away from being the stereotypical gay role. He just re-enforced it.
This show should show more responsibility. It also needs better writers.
It was one thing when there was “Just Jack”. Jack and Karen were the comic relief. Then they took over the show. Their characters were funnier, though not more interesting, than Will and Grace. Will and grace had a friendship, and that was boring, apparently. So they let Grace date and get married. Good for the character, bad for the show’s premise since she’s moved out. Will, though hadn’t progressed much because they hardly let him date. He meets up with a guy occasionally, but more often than not, he ends up being the foil for Jack who’s out doing something stupid. Oh how fun.
Now Will, having a real, caring relationship with a guy would be a step in the right direction. Then He and Grace could deal with their husbands, etc. But no. Here’s the synopsis of last night’s show.
"Fagmalion Part Two: Attack of the Clones"
Will and Jack coach Karen's cousin (Dan Futterman) on his new gay lifestyle.
What fun. They teach the new guy, who's recently left his wife and decided to come out, how to be gay. How do they do it? Tell him he’s got to have great abs, lose the beard, learn to dance, not like or understand sports, and wear expensive Gucci shoes. And Will and Jack are doing it to Help Karen get revenge on her Fundamentalist Aunt and Uncle, and because Karen offered to pay them to do it.
I know this isn’t real life, but there’s a few of really bad messages here. 1. Will and Jack don’t care about anyone but themselves. 2. There are no good mentors for those who are coming out. 3. Gays are all vapid little tramps. 4. There’s no room for diversity in the gay community.
We all know that the last one isn’t true, but your average viewer of the show doesn’t know that. Nowhere in the show was there talk of bears, chubs, minorities, etc. He was never told that there are other ways to be gay. That not all gay men are like that, and there is more than just looks. This is from the show that couldn't have a gay relationship last more than 2 episodes, of course.
Naturally, by the end of the show, like Pygmalion (or My Fair Lady, if you’re more familiar) the guy starts wearing the Gucci shoes and espousing “fabulous” and his mentors are thrilled that he’s finally got it. This is funny?
What a terrible message from a show that consistently wins awards from glaad.
This is especially discouraging to me. Since I still feel that I’m in the process of coming out to the community, and learning what’s out there, this show makes me feel terrible. If I hadn’t learned about bears, and other groups, how would I feel about myself trying to enter Will and Jack’s world? I’m sure there’s plenty of others in the closet now who watched last night's show. How must they be feeling?
Why do the writers and producers feel they must change the cousin to make him fit in with this one part of gay life? Do they think that this is really skewering the stereotypes? Not if you thought Will was a few steps away from being the stereotypical gay role. He just re-enforced it.
This show should show more responsibility. It also needs better writers.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
I think..
Date: 2003-01-31 10:05 am (UTC)Re: I think..
Date: 2003-01-31 10:19 am (UTC)Such is television, though.
no subject
Date: 2003-01-31 10:22 am (UTC)*sigh*
no subject
Date: 2003-01-31 11:17 am (UTC)Then he schleps back to them for more "help". Check your self esteem at the door.
Horrible writing.
ugh
Date: 2003-01-31 11:00 am (UTC)i didn't see the episode you're talking about, but reading your synopsis of it makes my blood boil.
Re: ugh
Date: 2003-01-31 01:46 pm (UTC)I've only seen one episode of Queer as Folk, so I'll reserve judgment.
Re: ugh
Date: 2003-01-31 11:19 pm (UTC)Re: ugh
Date: 2003-02-01 05:55 am (UTC)I just think that it's a shame that the felt that they had to make the cousin conform to one particular stereotype to be gay, without really looking at the diversity of the community. He didn't have to change to be accepted.
no subject
Date: 2003-01-31 07:10 pm (UTC)I think of it as the Jack and Karen show, but when I was in NJ the people I worked with referred to me and my friend Barbara and 'Will and Grace.' :-)
no subject
Date: 2003-02-01 06:16 am (UTC)Maybe my expectations are set a little high for this. Friends or ER don't have a similar impact to my life, and what I'm thinking. True, I don't look to them for sterling examples of straight life.
no subject
Date: 2003-02-01 06:39 am (UTC)ps you are cute.
Re:
Date: 2003-02-01 07:24 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-02-01 07:35 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-02-01 01:24 am (UTC)Gay male TV role models: Jody Dallas, played by Billy Crystal (fairly stereotypical, but not particularly pretty) with Robert Urich playing his gay lover, Peter Cambell (a tennis pro); To Catch a Killer (made for TV movie), John Wayne Gacy played by bearish Brian Dennehy (not the typical gay stereotype...unless you're talking about serial killers..yeah! Gay serial killers); In Living Color, the Wayans brothers doing Men on Film (how gay can you get! But African American gay portrayal--I felt bad for African American gays); Normal Ohio, William "Butch" Gamble played by John Goodman (a bearish gay character who's the lead--public didn't buy it and it went bye bye); Some of My Best Friends. Warren Fairbanks played by Jason Bateman (mostly "straight acting" twink) and Vern Limoso played by Alec Mapa (flaming Filipino queen--in all fairness, Alec is in a way, very much the character he played--the character was smart, independent and had a mind of his own). Some of My Best Friends was actually a good show, but lasted for five episodes--CBS aired the five different episodes on four different nights--shuffling it around so the public couldn't find it. There must be other gay characters on TV...these are the one's I remember...
Cliche but true: TV is not about entertainment, it's about sales. They call it mass media for a reason, it has to appeal to the masses. The masses appear to be 90% straight...and many of the other 10% are closeted. TV viewers need things spelled out for them and if a character isn't flaming gay, they may just be confused about their sexuality. When ever a show introduces a gay character, Americans for Family Values, the Moral Majority, etc. are required by their beliefs to picket.
Gay images the Moral Majority/Americans for Family Values support: Serial killers, child molesters, those who are beaten and killed.
My crap: No. I'm not into that... I haven't been a regular viewer of Will and Grace, but as far as I know, they haven't done an episode involving an evil twin, or the "save the _____" by creating a Broadway style show. Honestly, most sitcoms become desperate for new material after a few years.
I remember when there was suppose to be the first man-to-man kiss on network TV ( I don't remember the show), I remember the protest, I remember the anticipation, I remember it was edited out. Gays have, demographically, higher incomes, greater disposable income and an ideal target audience, but the religious right is vocal. So much of Hollyweird is gay..."when I was in high school, they had a gay support group...it was called the drama club"--Alec Mapa.
So to middle America, where there are "no gay people," and queer equals evil... TV perpetuates the idea that we are only interested in sex, not love...that we are incapable of long term relationships, not worthy of marriage... Of course when straights are interested in sex rather than love, can't maintain long term relationships, it's okay. This enforces the image to some gays that this is the way things are and that is the way we should act. In a world where good TV role models don't exist, some have to settle for those available.
We can't win... unless we try.
Michael, I love you...for your mind! Thanks for the food for thought... keep writing.
no subject
Date: 2003-02-01 06:07 am (UTC)That's a part of the point, this show, more than Friends or Frasier or something could do much more for the community if they would let Will have a relationship, or, in this episode, let the cousin tell them off, and go find a group of bears or something. No, we have to have Jack's narrow vision of gay life vindicated when the guy comes back for more lessons.
Thirtysomething is the show you're thinking of. In fact, after the didn't happen kiss, they killed off one of the characters. So much for that. No more troubles. Still, it got people to talk and think.
Just what do they think when they watch Will & Grace? Sure the characters are flawed, it's comedy, and a writing convention. I just thought that they did wrong by the messages they sent in this episode.
no subject
Date: 2003-02-01 08:00 am (UTC)SOAP corrections...
Date: 2003-02-01 09:57 am (UTC)Jody was much less stereotypical than anything recently on the networks. Dennis, his BF, bowed to pressure to stay closeted, and got involved in a sham relationship with a chosen cheerleader. Jody, in an attempt to keep his beloved, had chosen gender re-assignment, but on the eve of the surgery, Dennis came to him, told him that he was now "straight", and didn't want to see him any more. I particularly remember the attempted suicide scene that followed, where Jody was picking the pills out of a nurse's tray... some red ones, some white ones, some blue ones for color...
Jody came to his senses after that, and realized that no man was worth giving up on life. He went on in the show, to be come the first openly gay single parent on TV, complete with custody battles, and exposed the viewers to a lot of serious things involving discrimination that few other programs have dared tackle.
This was a character that knew how to camp, with or without a sleeping bag and a tent. I'd dare say, he was one of the most normal characters on the show, and, while not an infallible role model, he was far from a flat stereotypical character one sees in later programs.
Re: SOAP corrections...
Date: 2003-02-01 09:08 pm (UTC)the edited kiss
Date: 2003-02-01 09:44 pm (UTC)